Jose Reyes for Johan Santana?

So MLBTradeRumors is reporting that the Twins have initiated a deal whereby:

– Mets send Jose Reyes, Kevin Mulvey, and Hector Pellot to A’s
– A’s send Bobby Crosby and Dan Johnson to Mets
– A’s send Dan Haren to Twins
– Twins send Johan Santana to Mets
– Mets get Johan Santana, Bobby Crosby and Dan Johnson
– A’s get Jose Reyes and Kevin Mulvey
– Twins get Dan Haren and Hector Pellot

Got all that? If not, don’t worry, it ain’t happening. If it is, I’m likely not taking the #7 Train to Flushing in 2008. Santana would be very nice to have, but not at the cost of Reyes. Yes, from a practical standpoint, the Mets are probably better off with Santana in the rotation and Crosby at shortstop than not having Santana and having Reyes at short. I get that. But I don’t care as much about the practicality as I do about enjoying the games I’m watching. And even with Jose’s down year, and his occasional lapses in concentration, he is still one of my favorite players of all time due to his exuberance and everlasting smile. He remains one of the few players that I find “worth paying to see”.

I doubt highly that the Mets would pull the trigger on such a deal, and hopefully they won’t.

How do you feel about this possibility? (I promise not to chide you if you’re OK with it. No, really.)

Joe Janish began MetsToday in 2005 to provide the unique perspective of a high-level player and coach -- he earned NCAA D-1 All-American honors as a catcher and coached several players who went on to play pro ball. As a result his posts often include mechanical evaluations, scout-like analysis, and opinions that go beyond the numbers. Follow Joe's baseball tips on Twitter at @onbaseball and at the On Baseball Google Plus page.
  1. FrankStallone December 5, 2007 at 6:06 pm
    Plus the twins would probably not be able to pay for haren in a year or two anyway…..doesn’t seem to make much sense
  2. Walnutz15 December 5, 2007 at 6:32 pm
    This is a load of bollocks.

    Every report out there has Omar denying that Reyes would be included in a potential deal.

    This first appeared in the Metsblog comments section, under the “ESPN 1050 was reporting” moniker….and has hit message boards all over the ‘net this afternoon.

    Nothing in the way of confirmation, anywhere. Hence, it’s popped up on MLB Trade Rumors….one of the worst “sources” online.

    Much ado about nothing. You’ll likely see this one first:

    ^ Loved that one, by the way…great job by the creator. LOL

  3. Walnutz15 December 5, 2007 at 6:57 pm
    Call me Reverend Killjoy:

    3-way deal a “total fabrication”
    OK before it goes any further, let us kill a rumor that went from gestation at somebody’s computer to rampant chatter in the hallways at the Winter Meetings.
    The rumor was a three-way trade with many participants, but that essentially came down to Dan Haren going to Minnesota, Jose Reyes going to Oakland, and Johan Santana going to the Mets.
    Omar Minaya reiterated that Reyes is not being traded, which instantly doomed the idea. So did the fact that Minaya and Oakland GM Billy Beane have exchanged phone messages and e-mails, but have not talked at these meetings as of early tonight.
    But for the final word, we offer this gem from Beane: “I rarely comment on trades publicly, but let me comment on this one: It is an absolute, total fabrication.”

  4. isuzudude December 5, 2007 at 7:09 pm
  5. isuzudude December 5, 2007 at 7:11 pm
    However, there has arisen a new rumor of Detroit wanting to ship Willis and Pudge to the Mets in an attempt to shed payroll. The rumor was created by the mighty Sweeney Murti, who is going for a new world record of bogus reports within a 7-day period. If you recall, he also stated the Mets were “close” in landing Eric Bedard.


  6. Micalpalyn December 6, 2007 at 11:29 am

    so where does insanity stop and sanity begin?

    Insanity could well be what the Marlins ACCEPTED from Detroit for one of the games best hiiters and a streaky lefty pitcher who is young and undercontrol.

    While I think the Pudge part is questionable, it makes perfect sense to spin Willis who would be their 4or 5th starter.

  7. isuzudude December 6, 2007 at 11:48 am
    It makes perfect sense, huh Mic? Please read the following…

    …and now tell me it still makes perfect sense.

    Here are the questions you need to ask before you can assume the trade makes perfect sense:
    1. Who do the Tigers value enough that the Mets could offer to get Willis?
    2. If not needing a 4th or 5th starter, why would the Tigers still decided to take Willis from Florida knowing he was due for a pay raise in 2008?
    3. How trustworthy a source is Sweeney Murti, the Yankees beat writer, when detailing potential deals involving the Mets?
    4. If the Tigers have come this far in adding payroll (re-signing Pudge, Rogers, trading for Renteria, Jacque Jones, and Miggy), why would they suddenly pull on the reigns and start selling off parts?

    I know you love to disagree, Mic, but this deal had no shot from the very beginning.

  8. Micalpalyn December 6, 2007 at 12:52 pm
    Just seeing the glass half full as opposed to half empty.

    Note: the article you reference talks to ‘hyping/not hyping the fan base’ .

    – At this point the message (I see) in the referenced article is ‘ now we have Willis and our owner is not concerned with $$, we will accept the right offer but dont low-ball us’.

    – In the players you address Cabrera, Renteria, Jacque Jones there are clear upgrades, and Willis could be an upgrade too but represents a VERY expensive 5th starter.

    – In this crazy market (full of denials) why not spin Willis and recoup some of the potential you just traded away. Question: Did they WANT Willis or was he a tag-on in a deal really for Cabrera who they CLEARLY wanted? Knowing the Mets and others covet Willis and they could (at minimum ) grab Pelfrey and Heilman (and even Gomez) for him?

    – I think we will hear more on this subject.

  9. Micalpalyn December 6, 2007 at 12:55 pm

    Reference your own post yesterday (and that was my point): If some one told you there was a rumored trade of Cabrera and Willis to Detroit for Andrew Miller, Cameron Maybin and 4 minor leaguers YOU would written it off as farsical. …

  10. isuzudude December 6, 2007 at 2:19 pm

    Although I believe the Tigers got the better end of the deal from the Marlins, I never thought such a deal would have been farcical. I actually find it very believable that the Marlins were so desperate to rid themselves of Cabrera and Willis’ contracts that they took a package of 6 prospects – none of whom have proven themselves on the major league level. In the end, Florida did still wind up with what some call a top-10 prospect in the game in Maybin, and a pitcher who could mirror Willis’ production as soon as this upcoming season in Miller.

    In another post I made yesterday, which is found above in which I used the “insanity” line, I was pertaining more to the Willis/Pudge rumors to the Mets, which I think you have agreed with me on. However, you took that opportunity to spin it off as me saying it would be impossible for the Tigers to deal Willis by himself to anybody, which I never said. So you pretty much disagreed with something I never wrote.

    Anyway, as you write above, the Mets may target Dontrelle and send “at minimum” Heilman/Pelfrey/Gomez to Detroit for him. Are you joking? That’s the sort of package we’ve been urging Omar NOT to make for the likes of Bedard, Haren, and Burnett. Now you want to ship those three off for Willis, who’s really only had one “ace” like season, and who Detroit should be much more inclined to give up on-the-cheap if they really think his services are unneccesary and they can’t afford to keep him. If the Tigers only had to give up a package of prospects to get Willis, why would we have to give up 3 players who are major league ready for him? If Dontrelle really is available, then I don’t budge over a package of Pelfrey or Humber/Mulvey for him. I only envision Willis putting up Glavine-like production in 2008, which is nice if you’re only looking to replace his innings. But for us to give up 3 of our best young chips for Willis, that’s what I like to call insanity.

  11. Walnutz15 December 6, 2007 at 3:00 pm
    Granted, it’s the Winter Meetings — and there have been 600 different reports involving 600 different teams and players.

    However, I have no idea what direction this team is headed-in — and pray to Bob Murphy that they know what they’re doing.

    Reading this, and presuming it has any credence — I’m not so sure anymore:

    “The Mets made the strongest run at Rockies left-handed reliever Brian Fuentes, offering right-hander Aaron Heilman in a straight-up trade. The Rockies asked for lefty Scott Schoeneweis in addition to Heilman, and from there the talks disintegrated. The Indians also showed passing interest in Fuentes. The Rockies are trying to re-sign right-handed reliever LaTroy Hawkins.”…ry/7528844

    Reading that the Mets offered the most important piece of their currently-existing bullpen — for a left-hander similar to what they already have in Heilman — makes me question what their priorities are at this point in time.

    Granted, they have a better idea of what the market is — but to me, this does nothing for the bullpen.

    The concerning thing from my point of view is — the Mets offered Heilman to the Rockies.

    From this blurb, the only reason the deal didn’t go down was because the Rockies asked for Schoeneweis.

    I don’t see how adding Fuentes and getting rid of Heilman does anything for this team. Confusing, to say the least.

    Glad it went bust, and really…I hope someone has a plan they’re sticking to for this organization. This deal made no sense whatsoever.

  12. Micalpalyn December 6, 2007 at 3:17 pm

    Excuse me I had to re-read your posts reference the trade before I clarify.

    _ I might have exaggerated in my use of the term farsical. But until recently you and others have postured the Mets do not have the players to really add a prominent FA starter. Forgive me if i misinterpreted.
    -Dealing Willis by himself: You made a good point that the Marlins ejected them to save money. For me who and for what suprised most.
    – Clarification. If the Mets did target Dontrelle who has long been rumored to the Mets, I agree that (those) 3 players would be too much. I really meant 2 of those 3. I hear the Tigers covet Heilman.
    -I believe in the article I attached, it is said Omar (without talking about the target) said things had brightened in the last 24 hrs…
    -I believe now Omar has a line of sight on Santana ( i agree not favorable), Beddard, Willis and AJ.

    As you did earlier he could present various packages to the 4 GMs and see what window opens. AND i like you want the best bang 4 buck. I agree that a Willis (maybe AJ) could be had without giving up the entire farm.

    As I said yesterday I would try to add the best arm available but would try my best to hold onto Gomez, F-Mart and Mulvey.

    I agree on your package of Pelfrey (who replaces Miller very well) but I think the deal goes down if we offer Heilman. One article has the Tigers payroll in excess of 130Million. Thus the talk of salary dumping.

    I know what your view is of Aaron (now), but if Heilman and Pelfrey nets Dontrelle, would you do it?
    Note: Willis is under contract control, will cost about 10-12M less than Santana, and there maybe other releivers (albeit costly) who could replace Aaron.

    Note2: I never/rarely ever comment on the A’s rumors the asking prices for those 3 are in my view ‘dumb’.

  13. isuzudude December 6, 2007 at 3:58 pm
    I think our major difference of opinion centers around who we view as untouchable on the Mets. I fully agree with F-Mart, and mostly agree with Gomez, but I think Mulvey can be had if it lands us top quality starter. My untouchable list would include Heilman. I’m going to sound like a broken record, but I think he is just way too valuable to our bullpen at this juncture to give him up for anything less than Johan. So to answer your question, no, I would not trade Heilman and Pelfrey for Willis. His acquisition would only net us a #4 caliber starter (in my opinion) and would demolish our bullpen. Again, I’ll ask why would the Mets have to surrender 2 major league ready players for Willis when Detroit didn’t have to give up any to get him along with Cabrera? That equation just doesn’t add up, and I hope Omar sees that as well. Stick to a Pelfrey/Mulvey or Humber/Mulvey package and if Detroit balks, than find something else.

    As per Walnutz’s post:
    I read that rumor on metsblog as well. There’s just no way it can be true. Firstly, why would the Mets want to deal Heilman, in the midst of 3 excellent seasons in a row, for Fuentes, who is coming off a season in which he was removed from closing duties and would be a left-handed set-up man for a left-handed closer. Not to mention the Mets 3 best relievers would all be lefties, as I view Feliciano as 3rd best after Heilman. The rumor goes on to say the Mets backed away from the deal when the Rockies asked for Schoeneweis in addition to Heilman. WHAT? Not only would that sweeten the offer from the Mets perspective, but why in the world would the Rockies be interested in getting a guy who stunk out loud in ’07 and is due almost $8-mil over the next 2 years? It makes no sense at all. No surprise, the rumor’s origin is credited to Ken Rosenthal, who’s quota of one random and non-sensical trade rumor per day had to be fulfilled. What would make more sense is that either the Mets asked the Rockies to take back Schoeneweis in the deal and Colorado said no, or Schoeneweis is being confused for somebody else, like Pelfrey, Humber, or Mulvey.

    Mic, would this qualify as INSANITY, or is this still a justifiable turn of events in your opinion?

  14. Micalpalyn December 6, 2007 at 4:37 pm
  15. Micalpalyn December 6, 2007 at 4:42 pm
    Walnutz and Isu:

    You could do better in finding aricles of insanity.

    Metsblog had (i think) the days best courtesy of Buster Olney:

    Drum role……………………………………………………..

    AJ Burnett for Aaron Heilman.