Can Mets Get Anything Worthwhile for David Wright?
My former “boss” Rob Neyer relayed a completely fabricated and untrue rumor about a David Wright trade to the Phillies.
In the proposed deal, Wright would go to the Phillies in return for Domonic Brown, Vance Worley, and Phillippe Aumont. Personally, I’m not sure I’d do that deal, but all things considered — i.e., Wright’s contract situation and his coming off the worst season of his career — it wouldn’t be a terrible trade for the Mets.
What’s scary, though, is that Neyer termed the deal as “crazy”. Here is what he said:
I’m not sure about the Brown-for-Wright swap; the jury’s still out on both players, and there’s definitely a non-zero chance that Wright will turn things around and Brown won’t ever become the player we’ve been expecting. But yeah, trading Brown and Worley and Aumont would be the height of folly. Because, as taco pal well delineates, Wright just isn’t the player he used to be.
Oh my … this is scary because, when looked at objectively, from the outside (in other words, as someone who is not a Mets fan), he’s right.
Neyer concludes with this:
I won’t suggest that Wright can’t again become a brilliant player. And even at +25 and -11 he’s a fine player. But the trend is clear, and between his performance and his age and his salary, you simply can’t trade three good young players for him.
Which is why the Phillies certainly wouldn’t do any such crazy thing.
Again, I can’t objectively, er, object to what Neyer suggests. On paper, David Wright is trending downward. As someone who has watched every single one of D-Wright’s games for the past six years, I know why the numbers aren’t where they should be (injuries, beanball, swing change). But the point is, people who aren’t as close as you and me — such as scouts and GMs from opposing teams — see Wright much differently, and much more pessimistically, than we do.
That’s a good thing and a bad thing, depending on your perspective. If you are of the ilk to completely demolish every last thread of the Mets roster and start from scratch, then this is bad news, as it means Wright won’t bring back a lucrative package of prospects — at least, not if / until he proves he can be the “real” David Wright during the first half of the 2012 season. On the other hand, if you are one of those people who would like to see at least one familiar face on the field next spring — someone who has a legitimate chance to represent the Mets at the All-Star game — then this news may please you, because it means that Sandy Alderson will be forced to hold on to Wright at least until July.
So which side are you on? Do you want to see David stay or go? Why or why not? And what do you think the Mets can get — right now — in return for Wright in trade? Post your thoughts in the comments.
About the Author
Joe Janish began MetsToday in 2005 to provide the unique perspective of a high-level player and coach -- he earned NCAA D-1 All-American honors as a catcher and coached several players who went on to play pro ball. As a result his posts often include mechanical evaluations, scout-like analysis, and opinions that go beyond the numbers.
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Conflicted.
I like Wright a lot, but trading him would 1) presumably bring back some useful pieces for the future; 2) accelerate the pressure for Wilpon to sell the damn team to somebody who can afford it.
They should not trade David Wright. He should be to the Mets what Chipper is to the Braves. Sign him now, Wilpon… even if it’s the last good thing Fred can do before having to sell the team probably at the end of the 2013 season. My guess is it might be before that… The Wilponzi scheme ruined this team. Time to move on from the Wilpons, not David Wright.
Having said that, David should stay but they do need to make some moves. Especially at key positions, centerfield, shortstop & catcher. It seems that SP is left to the future (Wheeler & Harvey).
Angels have a loaded OF and I heard a rumor earlier this year of a David Wright for Peter Bourjos trade. Now, to me thats crazy – but I think Bourjos could be the future of the Mets. Lead off man, speed, defense and under team control for years to come. Angels need a 2b/3b and pitching. I would offer Murphy, Parnell, Familia for the kid and cash. Mets need both, young CF talent and money…
Doing this move will give Justin Turner a shot which is well deserved. Maybe signing a vet like Ryan Theriot to take over 2b. Parnell has great potential but ill take the CF over the RP any day. Familia is a nice chip but the Mets value Wheeler and Harvey more, a worth while chance on some one like Bourjos.
I don’t think Thole or Tejada will be the future of the Mets but it does seem they will get their shot in 2012 and will not be traded. Bourjos would be an exciting move, a new lead off man with speed! Defensive wiz and a fresh new face after the beloved Jose Reyes went to the rival Marlins this offseason.
PETER BOURJOS … please Wilpons, do something nice in 2012.
Its too late to trade him. I used to think DW would make a good second banana. Now I think you might be able to win the WS with DW as your fifth-best player. He’ll be long gone before we see the promised land again. I’d trade him for two of the three mentioned above. Yanks wouldn’t even trade straight up montero, bellcantes or banuelos for him I’d wager. At this point he is just sucking up money that should be used to re-hire the scouts they have been firing. This is a hopeless situation until we see the backside of the wilpons riding out of town.
ps- Doesn’t every team get someone at the all-star game? I’d way rather see R.A. out there saying something heartfelt and stimulating at the AS game than that mopey ass DW face we’ve all become accustomed to. A prosperous new year to you all (except you Freddie).
I always thought the Mets got it wrong with Wright and Reyes. Reyes never made the money Wright got and look at where Reyes ended up. I always thought Wright was a complimentary player and not a player that can carry a team. This is the problem with the Mets – they always bring in complimentary players – not team leaders. The last one was Piazza, and before that Hernandez and Carter. In between those world series there have been a bunch of David Wrights – complimentary players. With this said, I think Davidwill have a good streaky year and hit 30+ home runs with the fences now in.
I agreed with you until you mentioned Piazza, who was a fantastic player and the face of the franchise but never an on-field leader. The leaders on those Piazza clubs were Ventura, Zeile, and, to a degree, Olerud. Also you have to factor in Bobby V.
But otherwise, yeah … the Wilpons make a habit of bringing in good young boys who don’t make waves or have any personality. Who do you think was behind the deals to break up the ’86 Mets? Fred Wilpon couldn’t get rid of Mitchell, Backman, Dykstra, Knight, and anyone else with a hint of personality fast enough. But hey, Kevin McReynolds was a pleasure to watch and Art Howe lit up a room.
Reyes didn’t make the money Wright did b/c he wanted a shorter deal so that he could be a FA at a younger age and make more money in the long run. Year to year the salaries of Wright were pretty similar….the difference in total money was really at the end of the deal, the years Wright wanted and Reyes didnt.
I don’t think there was a problem with the contracts either guys got. But I do agree they should have brought more players here over the years. Though I think the lack of smaller moves…solidifying the pen, getting some solid starters other than the ones that cost $20 mil were bigger problems than not getting more expensive stars
You couldnt be more wrong about the Reyes deal. At the time of the deal everyone said Jose was upset with the deal he signed compared to DW.
You think Jose wanted to leave the Mets? He wasnt given a choice. And you know what, Good for him, when you are the 100% of the conversation of anyone who follows baseball to be a top 5 SS you deserve a little love. Jose never got that from the mets. He isnt a superstar, he gets injured to much, he dances to much, he doesnt deserve carl crawford money. I cant wait until the marlins come to town and ownership hears the most noise that will be heard all year from that morgue rooting for a marlin.
Who is “everyone”? Just the media looking to start controversy when there was none.
He could have had more yrs on his deal if he wanted…it was even said he was offered the same deal as Wright, but took the shorter deal so he wouldn’t have to give up his FA years… knowing he’d likely make more money in the long run. And really at the time of that deal Jose only had about 3-4 productive months of baseball under his belt. He was terrible in 2005…the deal he got was pretty sweet for a guy who hadn’t even put together a good full season at that point.
And please spare me the Jose didn’t get any love nonsense. If anything he escaped the criticism much more than anybody else on the team. Yea opposing teams complained about his handshakes,..but that wasn’t from the Mets…and that was the worst critcism he’s gotten. Jose got a major pass for disappearing down the stretch in both 2007 and 2008, There was constant talk after those years blaming Wright and Beltran for being “unclutch” but it was Jose who barely hit .200 both those Septs and yet there was barely a peep about that.
And IF Jose really wanted to stay with the Mets, he wouldn’t have spurned their offers to discuss contract mid-season. He just wanted to test FA waters and get paid…which is fine…thats what most players do. But the poor Jose, didn’t get any love nonsense is incredibly offbase
Your right I couldnt have possibly have spoken to everyone like you did to back up your post on this comment board.
If it is true that this guy who had nothing his whole life had the nuts to gamble his first contract to get a little better second one, he is a better man then me.
I personally think the Mets backed the wrong horse from the begining hoping that DW would be Jeter which he is not. Reyes should have been the face of this franchise, lets watch how he lights up south beach.
I didn’t claim to speak for everyone.
But anyway, Reyes got a fair contract from the Mets. Getting less yrs than Wright wasn’t stopping him from being a “face” or a big part of the team…he was….until he left.
I’ve never understood this “Wright vs. Reyes” stuff. Reyes was a Met for almost 9 years…he’s always been viewed as a key point to the team….if they weren’t “betting” on him at any point, he wouldnt have been a Met all these years
I think the choice was made when they let Reyes go. But what do I know. At this point they might have players take care of the field and fire the ground crew. Its pretty evident that this team doesnt make smart baseball decisions but instead just go the cheapest way possible.
I think wohjr says much of what I would say, including the question/comment as to the All Star Game.
It’s likely too late to trade, ownership wants to keep him for appearance sake and that “deal” — lol. You had me at Worley.
Thanks Hobie, well said. However, I want to clarify my point about Piazza. Piazza led with his bat, the others like Ventura, Olerud, etc. were good “complimentary” players and spokesperson players. Thus, making my point about Wright. As an avid Mets fan I hope David does turn it around, which will help Bay (another complimentary player) and others like Ike but we still need that big hairy, scary, consistent, carry the team bat like a Piazza in the line up to secure a competetive team.
Ah, gotcha. Agreed on all counts.
If Bud Selig was treating the Wilpon’s as peole who have something to blackmail him with, the Mets would be in cusodianship and a neutral 3rd party would have to evaluate trades, signs etc like what happened in LA. The Dodgers, despite a bankrupt owner and the club for sale still resigned Kemp and made some deals and signings. With this BS going on in NY you can’t trust any deal as a step in rebuilding or contending because the only plan coming out of Queens is the desperation of the hapless and crooked Wilpons to survive as Met owners.
It’s not blackmail, Iz, it’s simply returning the favor. Back when the owners were looking to push out Fay Vincent, there were a few who were on the fence about the situation. Fred Wilpon met with those owners and convinced them Bud would be the best thing for baseball. The rest is history.
I think they should trade Wright for whatever they can get. They can put Murphy at third and there would be very little, if any, drop off, offensively. Granted, Murphy is not the fielder Wright is, but they will just have to live with that. By the time they’re contending again, Wright will on the downside of his career. I think he still could be a very valuable complimentary player in the right situation. He’d look good to the Cubs – I bet his numbers would rebound pretty quickly in Wrigley.
Actually I think the direct opposite. I think Murph’s D is probably solid enough and Wright’s has slipped they won’t be losing much of anything defensively with Murph out there. However, I don’t think Murph will match Wright’s offense. He did in 2011, but unless Wright’s back is permanently broken, he’ll exceed Murph’s production. The only area Murph might exceed him is BA, but he still would probably post a lower OBP and won’t come close to matching the power or run production
Izzy, you cannot fault the Wilpons for not trying to hold on to their business- after all wouldn’t you? What you can blame the Wilpons is for incompetence in managing a baseball team in the largest market. I agree the Wilpons need to go but their egos won’t let them which is unfortunate for all.
I don’t think Wright will get traded any time soon for the same reason that Reyes didn’t — Wilpons are desperate for some attendance at City Field and the Wilpons’ money problems are more important to them then their need for prospects. Not only will attendance at City Field go down, but attendance on the road will go down (I don’t see Brewer fans coming out in mass to see Lucas Duda). Chances of the Mets being on national TV goes from slim to none. Every small market team (such as the Mets) have one home grown player they pay some money to so there is at least one jersey people will buy.
Piazza saved this organization no matter how you look at it. He was the star player they needed. He always hit the big HR when they needed it. He carried those teams on his back. He brought fans to Shea. Wright is no where near Piazza because he can never carry a team. He needs to be surrounded by good players. His best years were when Beltran & Delgado were there to protect him in the lineup. He strikes out way too much. His defense has suffered from this. If the Mets can get a good package for Wright they have to move him by the Allstar break. But it has to be for major league players not prospects.
Major league players? Are you kidding? The Wilpons can’t afford MLBers! They’ll trade Wright for prospects currently in A or AA. That’s the whole point of trading him — to shed more payroll / expenses, and then sell it to the fanbase as a “move for the future”.
Its about the money. The Wilpon’s money. Wright is an expensive third baseman. We will finish forth with him or without him. Trade him while we can get some value. Murph starts at third.
The Mets will be lucky to finish fourth. They may drop so far down they wind up in the central division.
I say keep him. Wright will be fine- the fences in will help his output. Keep Murph at second. We only need a hairy, scary bat to take the pressure off of Wright and Bay. Can Ike fill that mold? Hmmm, we’ll have to wait and see.
Joe: Here’s the thing about Rob Neyer…it’s all about the stats. Rob’s almost blinded by stats that ignore the intangibles that a player brings to the game. While I respect his statistical knowledge, I tend to discount anything he writes for that very reason.
As for Wright…the Mets will trade him in July if they can get some stellar package of prospects for him. However, I’m betting that if they only get offered some semi-decent prospects, they’ll keep Wright for the short-term benefit of keeping fannies in the seats. That’s the way the Wilpons have operated in the immediate past (Reyes being a prime example) and that’s how they’ll do it in 2012…because what matters most to them is selling tickets in the short-term. And that’s why the Wilpons will never succeed with this team. So long as they have short-term money problems, their actions are always going to first go to benefit the short-term.
Please please please sell, Mr. Wilpon!
Rob, I’m glad you brought up Neyer’s perspective and I agree. And that’s the problem — those who spend too much time crunching numbers and not enough time using their eyes view Wright as less valuable than Domonic Brown. The way MLB front offices are run these days, there is a substantial number of people with that POV. So if the Mets try to make a deal with, say, the Blue Jays, Tigers, Angels, Reds, or some other team outside the NL East, those GMs don’t have much “face time” to go on and evaluate D-Wright on paper. Ergo, they won’t offer as much as we know he’s really worth.
Based on where things stand currently (Mets behind everyone in NL East), if this is possible they should do it. I would also like to see them pry Placido Polanco from the Phils because he is a defensive stopper. He could become the Mets new 2B while Murphy goes to 3B. Then the Mets would have another major league starter (probably close to a #2), a promising outfielder, minor league pitching depth and a real 2B. In addition, they unload $15 mil a year in spending. Now D Wright is the face of the Mets…but the way they are comprised right now, they will be last in 2012, 2013 and probably longer. With this trade (if the Phils would do it), a plan would be in place to keep the Mets somewhat competitive until the farm develops. Of course if the Wilpons would sell the Mets things would get much better immediately.
As far as the Wilpons go and attracting fans and all that, I don’t know if they’d trade Wright or not now or before the deadline. This also could be a crappy internet rumor even though some claim the source has been correct on other Phillies moves. Predicting the Phils would re-sign Rollins and Brian Schneider wasn’t exactly prime inside info.
However Neyer’s claim the trade would not be made because Wright won’t get back to what he was and Brown won’t ever live up to what he was supposed to be is silly. In a way those are the types of players that do get traded.
He then says because Wright won’t ever get back to what he was, the Phillies would not trade 3 good players for him. Well that may be true but it doesn’t necessarily mean it won’t happen involving other players.
This trade would be complicated as most trades are and because it’s Wright, it is more complicated. Phils need to move Polanco’s salary to make it work but Mets will benefit from moving Wright’s salary so it’s possible both teams give on that front. Not saying the Mets may be able to shed all of Wright’s salary in another trade but it might work.
The key to the deal could be Worley. Not sure the Phils want to move him and go with Blanton and Kendrick as the 4th/5th starter and it’d be hard for them to acquire another pitcher to replace Worley if they take on Wright’s salary. If they traded Worley, I’m not sure they’d give up Brown or Aumont but maybe a good mid-level pitcher and/or a mid level position player or 2.
On the other hand, Worley’s value may be highest right now although he is a solid 3/4 starter in my opinion. He is mentally tough.
As for Dom Brown, he did some good things at the plate (showed a good eye and better plate discipline) the more he played and still has a ton of upside. He probably needs a full year or close to it in AAA without being jerked around. Not sure the Phils would move both Worley and Brown though and Brown being the main guy in the package probably wouldn’t work for the Mets.
Sure it may just be a rumor but you can’t dismiss it because who says it has to be those players rumored anyway. And it does make sense that the Phils would want Wright purely from a need standpoint because of Howard’s injury and just the fact they could use a good power hitter. Wright still had very good OPS numbers in 2010 (much better than Polanco) and he can be a decent enough fielder.
It makes no sense to trade him now. Last season there was a partial reason for his performance; the cracked bone in the back. While he may never be the player he was in 2006-2008, if he is the player he was in 2010, then you will get more in July than you will now when teams are under the pressure to get a piece for the stretch drive. The Mets never would have gotten Wheeler out of SF if they had traded Beltran in the winter. Is is a gamble? Yes, Wright may further regress but life is a gamble and this one is not so crazy to take.
Often we equate our expectations with poor performance. We want Wright to be the guy he was 3yrs ago and if he isn’t we call him a bum. Even at 2010 levels he is not a bum. .283-29-101is better than all but a handful of 3b’s. He has value. Whether or not that value is greater as a trade piece or as a Met depends on what you get and where you are as a team. Those questions are better answered in July than now.
Glen is correct. It’s better to wait for July and hope that Wright will bring more in a trade than this winter. The only problem is that the Wilpons are so strapped that they may want to move his salary now.
Joe,
DW needs to stay, primarily because Neyer’s view is shared by most if not all MLB GMs. Despite what Sandy says, if the Mets could bring back a haul for him and remove his salary, it would have been done. I don’t understand the notion of keeping him as a drawing card or to appease the fan base, as it is hard to imagine that the fan base can be any more depressed. DW’s trending is concerning, especially his D and his being beat consistently with fastballs. Hopefully he can break the trend in the first half of 2012 This will help the club whether they decide to actually “rebuild” or if they extend him.
- Wright will be traded if a deal comes along. CB was worthless this time last yr coming off knee surgery. But he proved his health.
- Wright is an all-star GG 3rd baseman with a history of production. Stick him on the Roxx and they can run away with the NL. THAT gets wright value. Not one-for one player wise, but what could he do for a franchise. PLUS if he doesnt deliver/does deliver the team and he divorce next year.
THE OBSTACLE: (Other than the Curse of Nelson Doubleday) is that other GMs can sit and wait for desperation to set in.
I can remember how we used to fleece the Marlin’s of players when they were desperate to shed payroll. Now the Mets are desperate so teams will expect the Mets to panic, especially near spring training. I fear the Mets are more interested in shedding payroll then getting prospects
I agree with the above comments…the only issue is that D Wright does not have Reyes or Beltran to be on the bases or protect him. There is a real possibility that D Wrights best #’s may be only .280, 20 hr and 80 RBIs. The rumored trade pieces are value for value (if they include Polanco) at this point. I hope D Wright stays, does great the first half and a trade would be much more fruitful or somehow there is no need for him to be traded. I am looking at the cards we have right now and he is our only high value card. The Mets as comprised will not contend for several years and attendance will be terrible anyway; plus he has an option for next year at $16 mil which is a problem. I wish the Wilpons would sell; then an aggressive owner with $ could add missing pieces because the Mets are around 3 players away from really contending. But since they won’t they should get as much as they can for Wright. If they could trade Santana and Bay somehow as well at the trade deadline would help as well. Those two were not really part of 2011 anyway.
I think from a business perspective if they were to sign Fielder for what ever he wants, with an opt out clause In 3-4 years, Prince would put enough fannies in the seats to pay his salary. Instead of attendance dropping 200,000 it may go up that much. You could turn over Ike for a major league ready pitcher and up your chances to be competitive. A $$$ gamble for ownership, but maybe only way for them to retain ownership.
Heybatter, I have brought up signing Prince a couple times and turning around trading Ike, They could have made a secondary trade like the Padres just did for Carlos Quetin. Along with resigning Reyes. Would be a pretty competive team and enjoyable to watch and I dont think the money would have been to crazy, maybe 150 million.
But that is just Met fans dreaming because we are not going to have a winter like that for a long time. And I think we could have a couple years like the Pirates did this year which will give a lot of people False hope.
Ah Heybatter, you’re thinking like a real businessman, one who knows you have to give people a reason to buy your pocket. But, we have the Wilpons, they earned their money thru ponzi schemes. Runnng a business the old fashioned way. Not gonna happen.
David Wright’s worst full year in the majors (not beaned or playing with a broken back) was .283 avg, 29 hrs and 103 rbis.The five years at shea he performed like a future hall of famer.All the geniuses on this blog who whine amd complain about DW don’t have a clue what a good ballplayer is.I hope he stays but if he is traded i hope he goes to the Phillies and hits 40-45 bombs a year in that launching pad,Than i want to see what all the DW haters have to say.I don’t know what’s worse anymore.Watching the wilpons destroy the franchise or listening to all you mopes complain about the bext third baseman in the history of the franchise.
40 to 45 hrs??? give me a break.
And the reason people whine and complain about him is because he has underachieved and been awful. They could release him if the only reason he is on the team is to boost ticket sales. Because no one is paying hundreds of dollars to watch him strike out and bang his helmet on the ground 3 times a game.
Underachieved????When did you start watching Met games?Last September?Anybody who could write something this I stupid should find a new team to root for
I only wish I missed the last 5 seasons, 5 years ago people we saying they would rather have DW then Arod(who at the time was a close second to Albert for best player in the game). Now people are saying if we get Polanco from the phillies we can improve the team. And by the way no one flinches at the Placiodo talk.
I dont know what you want to call it. Underperforming, Underachieving, overhyped whatever, but DW has not filled the expectations EVERYONE has had for this guy.
Please dont waste your time with responding with his stats from 2010. They werent as good as they look at first glance, yes he hit 29 hrs with 100 rbi’s But compared to his early success in 05 to 08. He walked 30 times less struck out about 35 times more and hit about 30 points less then his avg.
Please give me the name of the player to replace him who will hit 29 home runs and knock in 103 runs.I’m waiting.Still can’t hear you.
I am not sure how to answer that, if you want me to name a player that can hit 29 drive in 100 mark renolds does it every year. But I would not try to replace D wright with a 3b. And do you think this team should give DW a multi year 17-20 mil a year deal? ARE YOU CRAZY
If I ran the mets and I would Have built my team around Jose Reyes and a first basemen. If it was last year I would have picked Adrian Gonz, this year Prince. I would have traded DW and Ike for pitching.
You complain about Wright’s k’s going up and you want to replace him with a guy who strikes out 200 plus times every year.(Reynolds).You have proved my point by giving me a name to play third.You are clueless.Doesn’t make you a bad person, but like a lot of other posters on these sites, you complain just for the sake of complaining.
Gary,
Not everyone is bashing DW. Most acknowledge his very good run but also acknowledge the downward trend combined with soon aging out of the “prime” playing years. I am rooting for DW to have a huge year in 2012, like I am rooting for the Mets to win the NL east. However, this most likely will result in his departure duringor after 2012, unless the Mets buck the odds and have both a strong year at the big league level, with the big pitching prospects, in court, and ate the gate. Possible, but highly unlikely.
Jeez Gary, lighten up!
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